Norwegian Houses
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Category: Modelljernbane i alminnelighet
Forum Name: H0 2-skinne
Forum Description: For spørsmål relatert til H0/1:87 DC
URL: http://forum.mjf.no/forum_posts.asp?TID=5421
Printed Date: 22 november 2024 at 17:18
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Topic: Norwegian Houses
Posted By: hburg01
Subject: Norwegian Houses
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 08:53
|
Hi!
Beklager for skrive dette i Engelsk :-)
One of my friends in Holland owns a large modeltrain store, and is since last year active with laser-cutting. With this technique he can and is making any kind of houses, stations etc.. predominantly in the H0 size.
This has become very populair both in Holland and Germany.
As he has been many times to me in Norway to look at my modeltrain layout, he is considering using the same technique for Norwegian houses. Purpose is to make a set of ready made houses/kits, and or make models on special requests.
My question to all of you is, is there a market for this, in other words are you interested in this? I noticed that most of you make Norwegian houses yourself!?
I think, but am not sure, that a minimum price would be about 40 euro"s for a laser-cut house.
Any input is appreciated!
Hans van der Burg
------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Replies:
Posted By: Ørjan
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 12:25
Yes please, would be my answer.
There are many that are scratchbuilding their houses, so I would recon that there are a need for this. ------------- Mvh Ørjan Utne Kor går toget idag?? |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 12:31
|
Thanks!
What is the most wanted periode for norwegian houses, epoche iv, iii, or older!?
Hans
------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: Ørjan
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 12:41
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any.... ------------- Mvh Ørjan Utne Kor går toget idag?? |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 12:45
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flott!
Ett spørsmal til:
- byggetegninger. how is this arranged in Norway. For example to get drawings from those houses, or for example of Oslo station etc.. Are these public available?
Sorry for all the questions :-)
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: Ørjan
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 12:51
|
Byggetegninger er tilgjengelige! Either Library or kommune eller slikt. (mix of english/norwegian)------------- Mvh Ørjan Utne Kor går toget idag?? |
Posted By: jevistad
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 16:44
Jeg kunne ønsket meg eldre småhusbebyggelse fra epoke I, II og III som ofte finnes langs jernbanen litt utenfor sentrum i byene.
Det er som regel her man har behov for mange hus og det blir for tidkrevende å bygge alle fra scratch.
I mitt tilfelle rund Sandnes stasjon
 http://kart.gulesider.no/m/p7UYL - http://kart.gulesider.no/m/p7UYL
------------- Hilsen Jon Einar  https://www.facebook.com/IndreStambane" rel="nofollow - https://www.facebook.com/IndreStambane |
hburg01 wrote:Posted By: Roger
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 16:59
|
Hi!
There is a lack of norwegian buildings on the market, so they are most wanted.
I would recomend a more generic approach to the buildings, so the could suit different eras. - But clappboard and board-and-batten woodbuildings would be the order of the day.
Instead of unique stationbuildings like you mentioned, Oslo, I would opt for the "type-stations" used for several different stations on different railways.
What I would like to see is:
I think 40 Euros would be reasonable for a reasonable detailed kit of a fair size. ------------- Med vennlig hilsen R  GER“Det finnes ett forbilde for alt” |
Posted By: kokken
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 18:01
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Hi, I"ve got the drawings on Snarum station on Krøderbanen. If it i possible to get that building lasercut for a set, it would be nice ------------- Mvh Tom-Andrè Engebretsen http://www.kokken.mj-blogger.no" rel="nofollow - http://www.kokken.mj-blogger.no |
Posted By: ses
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 18:11
Snarum station would be a good choice for a smaller Norwegian station
from the late 1800-time, since this type was used on 17 different
stations in Norway on many different railroads from Stavanger-Egersund
Rwy to Røros Raiway. The type is called "Hvalstad type" after one of these 17. The picture below is one of these: Stai station at Røros Rwy. ------------- Svein S |
Posted By: aha
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 18:46
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Hi!
Do not know what era it is but for me this is a typical Norwegian house from the 1970"s
 I take 2 of these
 Arne
|
Posted By: PaTrond
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 18:58
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Would the laser cutting make the wood panels too? 40€ (310NOK) sounds reasonable (to a point at least.)
Aren"t there people at this forum using SoldWorks? I"ve used it myself, but I"m using Mac at the moment. Anyway, SolidWorks is extremely useful when it comes to different types of 3D-printing/ -cutting. If the laser cutter has a plug-in for ArchiCAD too there is no problem for me to make 3D models. ------------- |
Posted By: Svein_H
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 19:07
I think this is a great initiative! I"d love a generic collection of older houses from the "Swiss style" era (1840-1920). A lot of these houses are still standing today, both modernized and restaured to their original splendor. Typical of the era are the detailed ornaments and woodcarvings in many different variations, plus the fact that a few generic footprints and shapes can result in a multitude of different houses. http://www.gamletrehus.no/index.php - Here"s a link to a site with more info on this subject. Svein ------------- H0, norsk på 50-tallet en gang http://www.hjemstad.no" rel="nofollow - Min hjemmeside |
Posted By: Laurenz
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 19:20
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Hoi Hans,
Drawings can be optained from a number of sources. At the railway museum in Hamar you can drawings for most stations and a lot of other buildings.
Drawings of modern house you could get from the catalogues of many house construction companies. Drawings of older houses I am sure can be found in some libraries and certainly the archives of the kommune(gemeente).
Considering the general price level in Norway I would say €40-50 is very reasonable. Typical norwegian houses are close to impossible to get as I am sure you allready know so this is very interessting!
Groetjes,
Laurenz
|
Posted By: Stian
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 19:40
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I could really prefer Ygre station, Garnes station, old Arna station, Haukeland station, Nesttun station, Krøden station or Vikersud staton. Some freight houses would also been "tatt godt i mot" ------------- Norsk matriell en gang på 60-70tallet Mvh stian |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 21:39
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Hi all!
Thanks for all the nice feedback, looks like there is an interest.
kokken: Can you send me what you have per personal email? I"ll send it to my friend, and see what he can do as a start.
Do note that the price indicated is a minimum, and is depending on size(who ever said size does not matter, hehe :-)) and other influences.
Patrond: I"ll keep your offer in mind, great thanks!
jevistad fra Sandnes: Jeg er fra Nærbø :-) Jæren er best!
I myself have N-scale, so am in the minority here in Norway,hehe. But 26m2 so enough to do, lol!
All, I"ll come back with more info as soon as!
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: MY1201
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 22:30
|
What about a typical Norwegian barn and farmhouse? ------------- Magne H.L. Norsk, dansk og det som er artig. |
Posted By: Ørjan
Date Posted: 14 mai 2010 at 22:59
Hans...
Bryne er jo midt imellom ------------- Mvh Ørjan Utne Kor går toget idag?? |
Posted By: PaTrond
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 02:19
Something by Snoarc (Snøhetta Arkitekter) would be nice 
I"m more into modern houses with more or less inspiration from older houses. Other than that I would prefer log cabins with or without panelling from 1800-present. %20 - http://www.belco.no/var/ezwebin_site/storage/images/nyheter/stort_opplegg_paa_klosteroeya_skien/9338-1-nor-NO/stort_opplegg_paa_klosteroeya_skien_largelightbox.jpg %20 - http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_G75iQkI5x6A/StPGb_zfzwI/AAAAAAAAAJQ/w4vGKZA6Y-g/s400/snipetorp%2520i%2520skien.jpg An example of a little transformer house made in modules (yep, the panels, door, concrete, etc. is all separate): %20 - http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3504820&l=0591f34816&id=718780574 Made in Solidworks (Student lisenced - no commercial use) ------------- |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 09:26
|
Hi All,
Kokken: could you please send the drawings of that station as soon as possible?
Ørjan: så flott, Bryne! Looks like an expansion of train-friends here, hehe :-)
All,
We"ve decided to start with a test. This because perhaps you guys don"t like it, or is there something else :-)
So, we will make 10 of the Snarum station layout first, in H0 scale.
As soon as I received the drawings from Kokken, we will get started. The process is that from these drawings new drawings are made for the laser-cutting machine, then the materials need to be ordered. We use the same materials as Noch uses for their new bridges and such, and the level of detail is astonishing!
Wood cladding/panels, all little details are included.
These 10 examples will be delivered as model-sets, so just like Faller and such, you need to put them together. Material is perfect to apply some weathering yourself also!
We then collect the feedback from the ones that bought these 10, and use that to see what details need to be adjusted in regards to typical Norwegian details, and this will then serve as the basis for future development of more houses.
We expect to be ready with these 10, right after the summer. If there are more then 10 already interested than let me know please, no problem to make more in the 1st batch!
Should this kick-off, we will then also make a website where the models can be bought, and drawings be sent for new models etc.. But for now, please use this forum or my private email addresss.
Hope everyone thinks this is a good idea and the right way forward!
Regards,
Hans van der Burg ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: øystein lb
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 09:47
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Send one to me! I order one now. I have use thes days to bild one of this: http://forum.mjf.no/forum_posts.asp?TID=5394&title=holdeplass-i-h0 - http://forum.mjf.no/forum_posts.asp?TID=5394&title=holdeplass-i-h0 Her can you se my progres and work: http://forum.mjf.no/forum_posts.asp?TID=5420&title=ysteins-bygge-blogg - http://forum.mjf.no/forum_posts.asp?TID=5420&title=ysteins-bygge-blogg
Its made from bass wood i think, contact Håvard H and ask. This material is very plessent to work whit. But i think that you need to bay some kappler or Northestern strippwood to. ------------- Blogg: http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/%20" rel="nofollow - http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/ Epost: oysteinlb(krøllalfa)gmail.com Tron |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 10:06
|
Thanks :-)
As said, after the summer :-)
Making the drawings and doing the programming will take some time, but I"ll keep you in mind!
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: øystein lb
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 10:14
|
thank you. i dont men that i need this bilding now, but that i order one when they are compleated and redy for sale. ------------- Blogg: http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/%20" rel="nofollow - http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/ Epost: oysteinlb(krøllalfa)gmail.com Tron |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 10:20
|
haha! okay, looks like "jeg må lære og snakke Norsk så snart som mulig, for og unngå forvirringer, haha!
Bare for ordnes skyld, dere trenger ikke og svare i Engelsk. Gå helt greit og forstår Norsk, men skrive i Norsk er ikke min beste side akkurat nå.
Vi snakkes snart! Jeg bare venter på tegninger så er vi i gang!
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: Dag Cato
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 12:45
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Hei Hans. Du skriver da norsk kjempebra synes jeg
------------- MVH DC Steinsnes? Hvilken Steinsnes? |
Posted By: Amatøren
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 13:10
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Øvelse gjør mester....
------------- Man lærer så lenge man lever. 
http://digitalhuset.net/wbb - Digitalhuset Vokser stadig, men ikke for store.... |
Posted By: Laurenz
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 13:25
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Med fare for spore av tråden; jeg tror jamen vi snart er flere Nederlendere en Svensker her på forumet :-)
Gleder meg til stasjonen nå den kommer!
|
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 17:40
|
Zal maar geen Nederlands gaan praten hier Laurenz :-)
Tilbake til emne.
Hvis noen har forslag, eller tegninger så kan du sende dette til meg.
Kan for eksempel godt tenke med at noen ønske og bygge Oslo Station fra fortiden?
For nå skal vi lagre n test production av denne andre station, men høres allerrede ut at dette kan blir en stor sak med masse andre hus i fremtiden.
Har noen peiling hva mye MJ brukere det er i dag, som har en tog-ban hjemme!?
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: Stian
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 20:56
Jeg vil gjerne bestille 1 slikt sett av snarum stasjon
------------- Norsk matriell en gang på 60-70tallet Mvh stian |
Posted By: Roger
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 21:03
|
Hei!
Har du noen bilde-eksempler på byggesett kameraten din har laserskjært fra tidligere?
Appropos tegninger ligger det noen svenske hus http://www.gotlandicaforlag.se/visbyvillastad/alla_ritningar/album/index.htm - her , men mange kan benyttes som norske også. ------------- Med vennlig hilsen R GER“Det finnes ett forbilde for alt” |
Posted By: ses
Date Posted: 15 mai 2010 at 21:57
|
Svenske hus er faktisk mer forskjellig fra norske enn mange tror, så hvis hensikten er å framskaffe ekte norske hus, får man holde seg til tegninger av norske byginger.
------------- Svein S |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 16 mai 2010 at 08:42
|
Hi,
No, I dont have examples here, or pictures, but have seen it.
I"ll ask him to send some!
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: Roger
Date Posted: 21 mai 2010 at 16:54
|
Hei!
Her er linker med tegninger av noen norske stasjonsbygg:
------------- Med vennlig hilsen R GER“Det finnes ett forbilde for alt” |
Posted By: TXP Skåra
Date Posted: 08 juni 2010 at 21:47
|
Kan jeg bare få si at jeg føler behovet for norske HUS mye større enn stasjonsbygg?! Jeg har selv en ganske stor jernbane, og dermed større behov for stasjonsbygninger enn de fleste, men har tross dette likevel flere norske stasjonsbygninger enn jeg har behov for. Det har jo kommet ganske mange satsjoner på markedet etterhvert. Men vanlige hus, derimot , har jeg kun ett - 1 - og det har jeg bygget selv.
Så mitt ønske er hus, hus og hus ... mange og særnorske!
Åsmund. ------------- Skåralinjen og FFK. Med bluesmusikk til. |
Posted By: TXP Skåra
Date Posted: 08 juni 2010 at 21:52
Forresten, ved nærmere ettertanke - kan jeg få Flekkefjord, Kornsjø, Steinkjær, Oslo Ø eller Langstein ... da skal jeg løpe og kjøpe! Og Usain Bolt ville fått problemer med å følge meg ...
 Åsmund. ------------- Skåralinjen og FFK. Med bluesmusikk til. |
Posted By: ses
Date Posted: 08 juni 2010 at 23:11
|
SteinkjEr Svein, nytrønder |
Posted By: TXP Skåra
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 03:12
|
Unnskyld! Man slurver ikke med navn! Lover fremtidig skjerping!
Kan jeg få Elverum, Koppang gamle og Halden også?
Åsmund. ------------- Skåralinjen og FFK. Med bluesmusikk til. |
Posted By: Chr. Lil.
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 09:52
Jeg slenger meg på Elverum
 |
Posted By: Ørjan
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 10:26
|
Bryne... ------------- Mvh Ørjan Utne Kor går toget idag?? |
Posted By: Øyvind Erik
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 13:39
Nja, hvis man bygger litt gammel bane, så het faktisk stasjonen Steinkjær fra 1905 til 1925... ------------- Øyvind Erik Planlegger H0 - AC, men med en liten DC-bane i tillegg. NSB diesel/damp. Driftsår 1960 og 2000. |
Posted By: Ørjan
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 14:22
Klepp Stasjon og Nærbø...
Glemte de!  ------------- Mvh Ørjan Utne Kor går toget idag?? |
Posted By: Espen
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 14:57
|
Bryne ?????????? Alvorlig talt Ørjan, Bryne stasjon MÅ jo vær den styggaste i heila Norge ------------- Mvh Espen Oversjefsnestleder Fladjæren mj klubb avd 3 etage og MJBV Hovedkontor. Marklin Digital. |
Posted By: Stian
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 15:31
|
Nei gi meg enten Garnes, Arna gamle, Nesttun, Hop, Minde, Ygre, Krøderen, Bolstadøyri eller Trengereid
------------- Norsk matriell en gang på 60-70tallet Mvh stian |
Posted By: ses
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 16:58
Jeg ville kanskje ikke sagt det så direkte , men heller sagt at Bryne og de andre fra samme tid på Jærbanen må vel være noen av de enkleste å scratch-bygge, så lite krimskrams og mange glatte flater det er på de. ------------- Svein S |
Posted By: øystein lb
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 21:09
|
Gi meg: Lenangen, Glåmos, Gudå, Malvik og Langlete så er jeg glad! ------------- Blogg: http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/%20" rel="nofollow - http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/ Epost: oysteinlb(krøllalfa)gmail.com Tron |
Posted By: MY1201
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 21:52
|
Så er du glad, ja. Men, hva med alle oss andre, som kanskje ikke ser etter stasjonsbygnigner eller ikke har plass til stasjonsområder? Bolighus fra 1920-tallet til dags dato er kanskje mere aktuelt for de fleste? To til tre forskjellige eneboliger i forskjellig farge, kan gi variasjon i et boligområde på anlegget. Personlig ønsker jeg gårdsbygninger, slik som låve, fjøs, utedass, stall, hovedbygning og møkkakum. Og kanskje lokstaller av diverse typer er noe å begynne med? ------------- Magne H.L. Norsk, dansk og det som er artig. |
Posted By: øystein lb
Date Posted: 11 juni 2010 at 22:45
|
Det var bare et ønske.
Men jeg skulle også ønske at det fantes gamle gårds byggninger og få kjøpt i tre. Bolig og nærings hus er også ønskelig. ------------- Blogg: http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/%20" rel="nofollow - http://nesttunrailway.wordpress.com/ Epost: oysteinlb(krøllalfa)gmail.com Tron |
Posted By: Ørjan
Date Posted: 12 juni 2010 at 00:12
 ------------- Mvh Ørjan Utne Kor går toget idag?? |
Posted By: Chr. Lil.
Date Posted: 12 juni 2010 at 00:33
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Bolighus vil nok selge som varmt hvetebrød
|
Posted By: TXP Skåra
Date Posted: 12 juni 2010 at 02:14
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Ja, var jo egentlig det jeg mente og... flere vanlige hus. Men jeg lot visst tankene fare ... det er så mange fine stasjoner også ... ------------- Skåralinjen og FFK. Med bluesmusikk til. |
Posted By: TXP Skåra
Date Posted: 12 juni 2010 at 02:16
|
Og Strømmen!!! Ingen som har tenkt på Strømmen! Fenomenal bygning! ------------- Skåralinjen og FFK. Med bluesmusikk til. |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 04 august 2010 at 19:33
|
Hi all,
just to give you a quick update on the status of the houses.
At crurent they are running test-runs. this means produce the material, build it together and to find out and eliminate all small errors, such that it becomes a perfect model.
They expect to start producing end of August, as also the german factory which makes the special raw material is closed for the holidays.
So expected delivery will be 3rd or 4th week of September.
I"ll give some more info around that time!
Hans van der Burg ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: TeVe
Date Posted: 04 august 2010 at 20:06
Finnes det fra http://www.scantrain.no - ScanTrain ------------- Terje V. |
Posted By: MY1201
Date Posted: 04 august 2010 at 22:30
|
Jepp, har bestilt. ------------- Magne H.L. Norsk, dansk og det som er artig. |
Posted By: Pelle
Date Posted: 12 august 2010 at 15:46
"Empir" or "Sveitserhus" is very common in Norway, and should be a natural part of the landscape, but unfortunately no one has made such houses yet. Personally I would like a couple of these ...         http://www.google.no/images?q=sveitserhus&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:nb-NO:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=NfljTOHyHYGoOLyOgbIM&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCgQsAQwAA&biw=1440&bih=698 - You can find more images here ------------- Kjører hagejernbane i G-skala, N-skala og bygger H0 i messing. |
Posted By: TXP Skåra
Date Posted: 12 august 2010 at 20:07
|
Ja, dette hadde virkelig vært noe å sette ut oppe i lia på Skåralinjen! Vakkert, vakkert! ------------- Skåralinjen og FFK. Med bluesmusikk til. |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 12 august 2010 at 20:37
|
Hi!
Very nice and good idea!
I"ll send it to Holland for an opinion.
But do note we want to wait to make this until we get some feedback in September on the sration we are going to sent out at first.
This to make sure, that if there is anything that needs to be improved in regards to production, that it will be easier to correct it.
But if this turns out to be a success, we will start making a lot more models that are not available today!
Until soon!
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 22 september 2010 at 11:24
|
Hello everyone again!
Well station Snarum is as good as complete, and ready for production.
I"ve attached 3 pictures on how the 1st build looks like, great detail!
Over 200 parts. Do note that the build shown on the picture is not the final color scheme. This will be included when we start shipping.
We are also looking for a distributor with an online shop, and hopefully this will be a done deal very soon
Expected shipment will be in 2 weeks. Those of you that have shown their interest to be a part of the 1st group, will need to sign-up with the distributor to have it sent. I simply dont have the time or means to go and actively work on this myself.
I will disclose the name as soon as all is approved and agreed
Keep in touch, and I hope you like the pictures!
The pictures are here:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Snarum-Station/127005400683138?v=photos#!/album.php?aid=23605&id=127005400683138 - http://www.facebook.com/pages/Snarum-Station/127005400683138?v=photos#!/album.php?aid=23605&id=127005400683138 ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: TXP Skåra
Date Posted: 22 september 2010 at 11:35
|
Very promising pictures! Nice job, lads! ------------- Skåralinjen og FFK. Med bluesmusikk til. |
Posted By: Stian
Date Posted: 22 september 2010 at 11:52
|
Awsome!
I am happy for preordering that station! ------------- Norsk matriell en gang på 60-70tallet Mvh stian |
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 22 september 2010 at 12:40
|
Thanks :-)
note, don"t let the pictures fool you. This is lasercut material, far better than plastic modelkits.
It allows for a great deal of more detail, such as the wooden cladding and all.
I"ll come back soon to the place to order!
Hans ------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |
Posted By: Mr Bridger
Date Posted: 22 september 2010 at 12:41
|
I have sent you a PM
------------- Tore Hjellset, Tønsberg http://grimstadline.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow - Grimstadbanen 
|
Posted By: hburg01
Date Posted: 23 september 2010 at 15:52
|
Hi!
This is going to be my last message on this.
The process is completed, and the station is next week in final production.
The set can be ordered through the normal Norwegian channels being:
http://www.alvalia.no - www.alvalia.no
http://www.togbutikken.no - www.togbutikken.no
Expected shipment date to Norway is 1st week of October, so a little more patience :-)
Takk for alle god inspill!
Håper alle liker dette, og lykke til!
Hans van der Burg
------------- Hilsen, Hans van der Burg |